Interesante entrevista a Vanessa Marshall, dobladora de Hera Syndulla en Star Wars Rebels para la página web
TheDailyDot. En ella hace un repaso de lo acontecido en la segunda temporada, por lo que si no has visto estos episodios y quieres estar libre de spoilers será mejor que no continues leyendo. Aquí os dejo la entrevista, pero podeis vistar la página clicando el enlace de arriba.
The Daily Dot recently spoke to
Marshal about the season finale and everything that preceded it in season 2,
including Hera's tense reunion with her father, her complicated feelings for
Kanan, and her approach to leadership during dark times for the Rebellion.
Let’s start with the season finale.
What was your first reaction when you saw the way Ahsoka’s fight with Vader
ended?
I stopped breathing. And I felt
hopeful, ultimately. It wasn’t until the second viewing, at home, that I broke
down sobbing. [laughs] Just because it was so poignant and perfect, and I was
really able to get more into the details of exactly what I was looking at. It
was more like a state of shock. It was almost like a massive car accident
[laughs] the first time around. I felt physical shock and awe.
Can you elaborate on the “hopeful”
aspect? That’s interesting to me.
Yes. Well, here’s the thing: I
understand that she walked away from the Jedi Council. I know, also, that Yoda
sent her to Malachor. My feeling is that Yoda is aware of who Anakin has
become, and the only person, quasi-Jedi, who may have righted the Force would
have been Ahsoka. Not only could she handle it, but perhaps she could turn it
around. And worst-case scenario, given what we learned in season 6 of The Clone
Wars with the Yoda arc, in terms of the afterlife and Force ghosts and Qui-Gon
and all that—[I thought] that even though she’s not technically a Jedi, perhaps
she could intuitively embrace some of those ideas of being a Force ghost.
All of that being said, I’m not sure
which version of what I just described is going on, but I didn’t feel that she
died, and that made me very hopeful. It wasn’t a finite ending. It was very
open-ended, and I appreciated that.
As a matter of fact, I think it was
perfect for Clone Wars fans, because if [executive producer, former The Clone
Wars supervising director, and Ahsoka co-creator Dave Filoni] actually killed
her, I don’t know that … I don’t know that I could function. So that’s kind of
him to have left it open. And I think in a weird way, that’s the only way you
could win with that ending.
Well, I think I know Dave Filoni
well enough to guess that he hasn’t told you and the rest of the cast what
happens next for Ahsoka—
No idea.
—he wants to keep that close to his
chest. But what do you think would be a cool way for her to reappear, if she
does?
Oh, boy. That’s a really great
question. I haven’t even journeyed that far. I really don’t know. I mean,
here’s the question: Would she become a Force ghost? Would she transform into a
different kind of energy, and have the ability, like Obi-Wan, to sort of come
and go? [doing Alec Guinness impression] “Luke, use the Force.” Would she? I
don’t know.
Some would argue [that] she was
never officially made a [full] Jedi. She says [in the season 2 finale], “I’m no
Jedi.” Would that even be possible, given what I’ve said before—that she may
have been so close to becoming a Jedi that she may naturally have an open heart
to that kind of transformation. Perhaps Yoda would know that, given what he has
learned [about the nature of the Force in The Clone Wars].
Somehow I don’t necessarily see her
coming back in a physical form. [I think] that she will be of assistance—she’s
more powerful now than we can imagine, if you will, and that she would return
in ways that would be quite mystical. But again, I have no idea. I really don’t
know. And it’s hard to even conceive of it. I mean, I’d love to hear your
thoughts on it, really.
Well, I don’t even know where to
start with that. We could talk for a whole hour about just this subject. But
that might be a conversation for a different time. I’m sure a lot of good
fanfiction is coming out of the end of season 2.
Well, not only do we not know what’s
next. We don’t even know what just happened.
Yeah. It was left unclear, and I
think that was a very interesting way of handling that.
Yeah. I think it was awesome.
Another big unresolved part of the
season finale is what Darth Maul will be up to after re-emerging from hiding,
trying to mentor Ezra, and barely escaping Malachor with his life. Were you a
big fan of him when Dave Filoni brought him back from “death” in The Clone
Wars, and what do you make of what he’s become?
Oh, I love every second, every
moment, that [Maul voice actor] Sam [Witwer] speaks or breathes. He is a
genius. I loved that entire arc in The Clone Wars with him. And it’s funny to
watch the background footage on the DVDs where they show him sort of performing
the role—the way he would contort his body, I mean, it’s such divine commitment
to a bit. I think he’s an absolute genius. You’d think he couldn’t do any
better, and he just … he killed it [on Rebels]. He really did. It was
brilliant.
I’m happy to have [Maul] back, and
I’m curious to see where he goes as well.
When Hera and Kanan reunite after
the Jedi mission in the season finale, it’s a very emotional moment, because
Hera is worried about how Kanan’s injury, his blindness, will affect him. Do
you think Hera wishes she had overruled his insistence that the mission was
Jedi business and gone along to watch his back? How are her conflicting
feelings—her respect for his customs and her care for his safety—warring within
her in that moment?
I think she would consider it
selfish for her to do anything other than what she did. I think she considers
the highest good for the group, as well as the Alliance and the [establishment]
of the Rebel base and their overall goals. These are the costs of standing up
to such immense evil, and I think she has known that all along. To get selfish,
petty, and needy at this point—in terms of asking him to stay with her or let
her go—I think, would really be completely counter to everything she’s built up
until that point.
She may sort of inwardly feel many
of the things you described, [but] there’s no way on Earth she would ever ask
any of that of [Kanan]. I think she feels deeply sorry for the loss of his
sight, but I don’t think she second-guesses what transpired, and I think she’s
grateful he’s alive.
Do you think that Hera is insecure
about, or uncomfortable with, being unable to offer Ezra the Jedi training and
wisdom that Kanan gives him? Because those two have something that the other
members of the Ghost crew can never understand, and that kind of separation can
cause anxiety or tension in a tight-knit group. Is that something that Hera has
to wrestle with, and how do you see her doing it?
No, I think that [the members of the
Ghost crew] were chosen specifically for the way they fit together. I think she
knew that Ezra would complete Kanan’s [unfinished] Jedi [training] process, in
the sense that … once [Kanan] becomes a teacher, he’s no longer a student,
therefore he must have learned something to boost his confidence. That
strengthens [the rebels’] cause.
But Ezra, I think [Hera] sees that
ability in him, and while she maybe embodies Jedi principles, she’s not
Force-sensitive. Deferring to [Kanan] to let them both blossom in that way and
mutually benefit one another—again, I think it’s Hera’s understanding of the
bigger picture, not about her own
abilities. She’s very good at delegating and putting the proper people in
charge and letting them do what they do best.
I’ve often said that she brings out
the best in people and helps them discover things about themselves that they didn’t
know they had. In a weird way … that’s what she wanted all along, was for
[Kanan and Ezra to develop a special Jedi bond].
But that’s a great question,
because, indeed, she can’t give Ezra what Kanan so clearly can.
Speaking of Ezra’s growth, the finale
leaves his situation very ambiguous. At the very end, we see him opening a Sith
holocron, and Jedi aren’t supposed to be able to do that. Is there anything you
can cryptically tease about how Hera will react to whatever’s going on with
Ezra?
Honestly, I have no idea. I wish I
could comment or tease. I’m ill-equipped. I’m ill-equipped to philosophize
about Ahsoka or Ezra. I’m equally clueless—which, I guess, is a great way I
still get to be a fan of the show, because it’s always a discovery for me.
Just in general terms, obviously, if
something like were to go down, where he would go down that path [toward the
dark side], I think it would break her heart—not only because it’s a loss for
the Rebel Alliance. It’s like, you can either use your powers for good or evil,
and you can walk toward life or you can walk toward death. Not to denigrate the
Sith path, by any means. [laugh] Sorry, I know there’s power in passion. But I
do think that that would be very sad.
[It’s] almost as if you would lose
someone to an addiction or something like that—where they could have many
different things had they not done that. I would imagine it would be very sad
for her to see that, especially after Kanan had put all that effort in. But I
don’t know. I can’t wait to see. I pray that that does not happen. [laughs]
Well, I think a lot of fans would be
very surprised, because I don’t expect them to go in that direction with Ezra.
But of course, he is young and impressionable. You never know.
Yeah. I’m hoping it’s sort of like
the middle-school bully who comes around, and everyone wants to be accepted and
validated [by him], and maybe for, like, two minutes, you think you’re going to
be cool with him. And then you realize, like, “Oooh, hey now.” I mean, I love
the way Ezra kept [telling Maul], “Uh, yeah, my master’s not really into the
last part of that” [plan]. You know? [laughs] He still manages to have a
backbone pulling him to the light side, if you will.
They’re very different paths, and
they’re both very powerful—and means to very different ends. So...that would be
interesting. We shall see!
Obviously, a big moment for Hera in
season 2 was encountering her father, Cham, who doesn’t see the rebellion the same
way she does. He just wants to fight the Empire on their home planet of Ryloth.
He doesn’t care about the broader galaxy that she wants to save. And she’s
willing to jeopardize their relationship to pursue her mission, which shows
tremendous resolve. But do you think that single-minded approach has its
downsides, or will have its downsides in the future, in terms of Hera’s
wellbeing?
Well, I think that episode was
particularly healing for her. Because I think she longed to be understood by
her father. And that’s the most painful place to be, I think, is when you want
to be understood. Because that’s just a resentment waiting to happen. You’re
sort of putting your serenity in the hands of whomever you’re seeking the
validation from.
If you look at it very simply, Cham
focuses on Ryloth—that’s very local—and Hera is focusing on the galaxy and the
Empire taking over at large. Both are fighting for the same thing, neither
better nor worse, but I think because there is more destruction universally,
Hera really, truly believes that her way—while Ryloth is important—it should be
Ryloth and the various other places, [like] Lothal and so on, [that] are being
exterminated.
It kind of follows. It’s sort of
like, maybe your dad played the piano or something, and you’re in a huge
orchestra, [and] your dad thinks you’re an idiot for playing with other
instruments. Like, ‘What the hell?’ You know? But at a certain point, maybe the
dad hears the music [as a group effort] and for once sees the child’s point of
view. I think they both expand.
I didn’t expect Cham to betray [Hera
and the Ghost crew]—when they finally got onboard [the Imperial ship they were
working together to steal] and [Cham’s people] all turned on [Hera’s] rebels,
that was like, ‘Wow, dude.’ I mean, Hera, I don’t think, would ever harm her
father per se. That was pretty cold [of Cham]. But even despite that, I’m
really glad that they eventually came to fight side-by-side, literally, saving
the ship.
But you asked about her losses. I
think it’s been quite lonely for her. I think when one sort of turns away from
everything they’ve ever known—I mean, look, she’s lost her Ryloth accent, she
sort of reinvented herself to assemble a motley crew to conquer evil. Reading
[the Rebels prequel novel] A New Dawn and some of the other books and short
stories about Hera, [it’s clear] that she moves in a very stealthy fashion all
around, witnessing things and bringing people together in a way that—if
anything, I think the cost would be loneliness, ultimately.
She has sort of, up until this
point, been auditioning everyone for this crew. These people finally got the
parts, and now she’s here, and now the cost of that is that she may lose
members of her family. The stakes are higher.
To answer your last question, [about]
how does she lose in this, I think it’s loneliness. The danger increases, and
the losses seem to be greater as well, around her.
Another thing I found interesting
about Hera in season 2 is that she was given command of Phoenix Squadron, an
A-wing unit. She’d already had responsibility as the captain of the Ghost, but
how do you think her new role as Phoenix Leader has changed her? We don’t
really see her in that capacity very often; she’s mostly still with the Ghost.
Well, I think, once again, [just as]
it was important for her to be recognized by her father, I think it also feels
great to be recognized in that capacity as well. I don’t know that it really
changed anything for her, other than she was recognized [by her commander] and
that was an enjoyable experience. I don’t really see her role changing that
much. Maybe I missed something. It seems, pretty much, that she calls the
shots, people listen, sometimes they argue, but at the end of the day, it’s
still the “motley crew” I described a moment ago. At the end of the day, it
seems like [she’s Phoenix Leader] in title only; [it’s] not necessarily a
[full-time] job change.
I don’t know. Did you think that she
behaved differently afterward?
No. In fact, I was kind of expecting
there to be more A-wing missions. But it’s sort of the same old Hera.
Yeah, exactly. Well, I think it was
cool for her to be recognized.
Yeah, even if it’s just honorary or
a minor thing, it’s a reflection of the trust that the rebel movement puts in
her.
Right, right. She’s got a number of
nice moments this season, I thought.
And one of them isn’t even in a Hera
episode. In “The Forgotten Droid,” when the Ghost’s cantankerous droid,
Chopper, makes a droid friend, he tells him about how Hera rescued him after
his ship was shot down during the Clone Wars. And in “Homecoming,” when Hera
reunites with her father, she’s very protective of Chopper. We don’t know much
the early part of their relationship. Have you talked to Dave about how that
started?
I think she has a real soft spot for
him. Once again, she’s collected these specific people, or astromech [droids],
for her cause. I mean, Ezra was on the streets and she gave him a life—they all
did, in a way; [they] gave him direction. Chopper also was given a bit of a
life and a family, even though he’s sort of a grumpy astromech.
[Dave] didn’t really talk about it
much more than it’s written in the script, so I was pleased to see that episode
and learn even more [about Chopper and Hera’s relationship]. And hopefully
we’ll learn more in the future as well, as to the specific circumstances. They
have a special relationship, and I love that.
I feel like Chopper is the least
explored member of the team, and yet, now that we know how he came to be part
of that group, I’d love to read a comic book or something that explores that in
detail.
Yeah, yeah. Well, maybe we’ll learn
more. Hopefully we will. Maybe they’ll have a flashback or something.
Switching gears a bit...I was
surprised that Hera was so adamantly opposed to trusting the purrgil, those
so-called “space whales” that initially frightened the crew when they
encountered them in “The Call.” Ezra sensed through the Force that they meant
no harm and could help the crew find their destination, but Hera brushed him
off, saying she’d heard legends about their destructiveness. It seemed unlike
her to refuse to listen to Ezra’s Force instincts like that. Did that surprise
you when you read the script? Can you talk about how you see that scene fitting
into her character?
You know, I asked Dave about this,
and there’s a couple things. One, I think she lost friends due to purrgil
flying in the path of her fellow pilots’ ships. I felt that she had personally
experienced suffering at the hands of the purrgil. The legend part seemed to be
whether or not they had something to do with the concept of hyperspace.
Dave said that he specifically
wanted to illustrate, in that episode, that someone could have an opinion at
the beginning of the episode and change their mind and learn something by the
end. And he felt that that was a really important lesson for people—[for them]
to notice that, in the Star Wars universe, there are lessons like that, and
that people are capable of changing.
When I hear about these drones that
are flying in the path of commercial airliners in the U.K. or Europe, it’s sort
of the same concept. “Uhhh, I’m a little wary of those things. That’s not
good!” [laughs] If [you think] you’re going to be shot down out of the air or
[experience] some sort of collision thanks to some drone … the apprehension
there may come from empirical evidence that, if they get in the path of a ship,
the ship will cease to fly. [laughs]
There were a lot of people, on
social media, who were like, “Whoa, purrgil-hater!” I’m not necessarily a
drone-hater. I just am aware of the danger that, if they fly in front of an
airplane, we might have an issue. I think it’s a similar kind of disdain or
apprehension [from Hera about the purrgil]—the purrgil are the purrgil, but you
put them in space, flying near ships, and we have a massive problem that could
mess up a rebel base or have serious consequences and loss of life and
friendships.
I thought it was cool that Dave
wanted to demonstrate that—that we can learn things in the Star Wars universe.
And in fact, [the purrgil] did have something to do with hyperspace, as is
illustrated by the end of [the episode], so [Hera] could see more of the beauty
in that and side more [with] the wonder of that, if you will, as opposed to
whatever she had witnessed or experienced in the past with them destroying
ships in flight.
It occurs to me that perhaps, in
these other encounters with purrgil, people thought the creatures were hostile
and panicked and made things worse for themselves. The Ghost crew was fortunate
to have a Jedi aboard who could sense their pacifism and react accordingly.
Maybe the ships that met grisly fates weren’t that lucky.
Exactly, exactly.
My dad is a pilot, and he loves
seagulls. When he’s in the air in his open-cockpit biplane, he’s not really a
fan of seagulls [laughs] because unfortunately, they do collide with pilots.
Never my dad, but I remember flying with him one time, and I said, “Dad, are
those seagulls?” They were flying very near to the plane, and he said, “Ah,
yeah, I’m moving.”
So when we did that episode, I was
thinking of the seagulls and my dad being apprehensive or cautious around them.
Because that’s not going to be a good thing if you [slam into] one mid-air. God
forbid, that’d be horrible. But I viewed it as something similar: I love
seagulls in general, but not when I’m in an open-cockpit biplane. [laughs] At
that point, I’d like for us to keep in our own lanes.
I likened it to that flying
experience that I’d had with my dad.
You’ve mentioned before how your
dad’s experience as a pilot helped inform how you played Hera when she flew an
early prototype of a B-wing starfighter. You had to play her as someone
exhilarated by the joy and the freedom of flight. Has your dad’s experience
helped you play Hera in other ways?
I think it’s with me in every
episode, as she makes these maneuvers that are mind-boggling. My dad does that,
too. My dad does these hammerheads. He does the aerobatics. I mean, it’s a kind
of fearlessness, with an attention to detail, that cannot be reckless. It’s so
many things all at once that it’s mind-boggling to me personally. If you put me
in a plane, it’d be like, “Wooo, shiny beads!” It wouldn’t necessarily be my
first choice ever. So I’m always impressed with his ability to be so
disciplined and so focused and pay such close attention to detail, while
equally trusting gravity, and whatever else, to right the plane by doing a
nosedive and all these other crazy things.
Whenever [Hera] does those in any
episode—and they do have them quite often—I think of my dad and his ability to
do those things without having a heart attack [laughs] and freaking out like I
would.
I don’t know, man. I think life’s
hard enough. I don’t need to do a nosedive. I’m alright. [laughs]
Speaking of those maneuvers:
Obviously those are animated after you record the dialog, but when the twists
and turns are important to the scene, does the script ever lay out some of
those details?
Absolutely. And when we record it,
we have to envision the stakes and the sounds—it always seems like we’re
schmacting, it always seems like, “Oh, that’s way too much.” But it actually
isn’t. When you put it with production, it requires—when Han and Chewie are
screaming at each other, that’s how you have to get through those very tense
times. We have to bring that level of energy to the acting and the lines.
What it ultimately looks like, I see
that on television with you guys—we all watch it together—and it’s always
better than I can imagine. But I do have a sense of it, and I think back to
those times when I was doing crazy aerobatics with my dad.
To wrap up here, do you have a
favorite way that you think the second season of Rebels expanded or enhanced
the Star Wars saga?
I don’t know if I can say without
crying.
When Anakin’s face [showed through
Darth Vader’s fragmented mask] … when we see Anakin’s face, and Ahsoka [sees]
his face. For me … [pauses to collect her breath] … that moment will live with
me forever, much like when Ahsoka walked away [from the Jedi Order] in Clone
Wars. There was so much in that [Rebels scene] that finally came together for
me—that was a very mythic moment. And I’m not sure what transpires with Ahsoka
following that, but that was immensely rewarding for me, as a Star Wars fan
since the first film, going through the prequels and through Clone Wars. Yeah.
It’s an incredibly powerful scene,
and it’s clear from your answer that you’re a diehard fan of Star Wars and
someone who can appreciate these nuanced, mythic story beats.
Yeah. That was really … whoof. I’ll
never forget that image. Ever.
Well, I don’t know how you guys are
going to top that next season, but I’m very excited to see it however it
happens.
Yeah, I don’t know, man, but leave
it to Dave Filoni, leave it to Lucasfilm. Trust me. I don’t put it past them. I
have no idea how they do it. It’s just really amazing.
